THERE IS NO LOGIC FOR EXISTENCE

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Robert G.
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Post by Robert G. » Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:37 am

The Dalai Lama, as any other human being, sees duality because of the existence of the "I". But when you think deep, this "I" has no meaning, but you can't escape it... that's the existential conundrum.
Nandu, that conundrum only exists (I think) if you accept a dualist or whateverist position. Personally, I lean towards the position that minds or mental states (ie consciousness) emerge from the physical and biological processes going on in brains and nervous systems. Therefore, my mind is an actual existing thing in the universe. Ergo, no conundrum! :shock: . For me, all the religious imagery and "metaphysics" speak to the relationship of my higher-order reflective awareness to the less conscious or nonconscious content and processes happening within my mind/body. This is it! It is here, it is here! :D
Last edited by Robert G. on Tue Aug 14, 2007 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
boringguy
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Post by boringguy » Thu Aug 02, 2007 1:59 am

Sorry I'm behind here but have been traveling.

Martin;

I think that gets close.

I'm not sure about anyone else, but I feel pretty certain that I will be trying to deal with the strabismus of my two "I"s until someone is spreading my ashes.

Martin:

It's the thought that thinks.

Makes me think of Frank Outlaw's, It's all about character.
I don't have my reference (again I'm traveling) but remember it like this.


Be careful of your thoughts, for they become words.

Be careful of your words, for they become actions.

Be careful of your actions, for they become habits.

Be careful of your habits, for they become character.

Be careful of your character, for it becomes your destiny.


Choice. :wink:
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Martin_Weyers
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Post by Martin_Weyers » Thu Aug 02, 2007 7:29 am

Be careful of your thoughts, for they become words.

Be careful of your words, for they become actions.

Be careful of your actions, for they become habits.

Be careful of your habits, for they become character.

Be careful of your character, for it becomes your destiny.
I've heard that before, but it didn't come into my mind when I wrote that odd sentence It's the thought that thinks. That's exactly what I was trying to say though: Our thoughts sometimes seem to have a life on their own. What you have thought once will be thought a second time probably, and what is thought twice is in danger to become an obsession. In ancient times it was called a demon, today they call it conditioning. Today everybody's talking about the selfish genes that rule the world; But what about selfish thoughts? A monkey is a machine that allows thoughts to live up trees; Man is a machine that allows thoughts to live in cyberspace, ... :wink:
Works of art are indeed always products of having been in danger, of having gone to the very end in an experience, to where man can go no further. -- Rainer Maria Rilke
Joemac
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Post by Joemac » Sun Aug 05, 2007 3:35 pm

If there was logic for existence then you would not be free to choose. Logic follows a specific path and you are not allowed to make a choice or you would be illogical or crazy like the world is. So in order to be truly free in every respect there is no logical explanation. You have to discover the explanation. We are forever searching and discovering. Otherwise it would be truly boring if everything was logical like a computer which was designed mainly to do mundane tasks, logic gates.
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Post by boringguy » Fri Aug 10, 2007 12:28 am

Joemac,


Although I know nothing of logic to existance, I think at times the logic of science does give us the freedom to believe.

As an example, I find it amusing when I hear science and religion argue the whole evolution/creation argument. Each fairly certian that they have it figured out. Although the religion team always seems most adamant. I have to give it to science that at least they are standing consistant with their mandate, not sure I can say the same for religion on this one.

Seems to me that who ever created this card game, that we got invited to, went to a bit of trouble to make sure there was choice. Now if there were no other explanation for our existence than creation, then you have no chioce, no faith, GAME OVER. Science offers an alternative. Just funny to me that the religion team never gets around to offering this, and then concluding that God might have created by whatever way he chose, and that might include a process we call evolution. :idea:
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Post by Joemac » Fri Aug 10, 2007 4:59 am

boringguy,

I agree for the most part, but science is about to have its day in the court of humanity. So as you look south to what is occurring currently in Fallon, Nevada was caused by only one subterranean nuclear detonation. The current debate of the same subterranean detonations at the Nevada Test Site are somewhere between 600 to 800, enough that would make a large nuclear war possible.
The evolutionary elliptical cycle of Science (Theories) or Religion (Theologies) always seem to present a significant back lash, mainly because of the lack of love, humility, and fair play in both fields of interest.
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Post by Joemac » Fri Aug 10, 2007 5:14 am

Excuse me,

A very very large self inflicked nuclear war, or suicidal science of the largest magnitude ever created by man. Then those guys would go party in Las Vegas. I wonder what God is going to do with those guys?
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Post by Shu » Fri Aug 10, 2007 6:02 am

For most part, religion is something we are born in to. Choice hardly plays the major key role in that instance – more a conditioned response of blind leading the blind. Religion is unquestionably innate for some and yet religion has led to us to question and use logic to our existence.
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Post by Evinnra » Sun Aug 12, 2007 4:19 am

So, if I was born into an atheist family, it would be NOT my choice if I rejected or embraced my parents' theories, right? I am after all a computer who absorbs data and selects the useful bits, since there is no logic for my existence OTHER than circumstances creating the possibility of me emerging. Then how on earth did love come into the picture? :roll:
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Post by Shu » Sun Aug 12, 2007 9:25 am

Evinnra wrote:So, if I was born into an atheist family, it would be NOT my choice if I rejected or embraced my parents' theories, right? I am after all a computer who absorbs data and selects the useful bits, since there is no logic for my existence OTHER than circumstances creating the possibility of me emerging. Then how on earth did love come into the picture? :roll:
It would be your choice, but not all embrace that choice.

I'm not quite sure what you mean with the "love" question, Evirnnra?
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Post by Evinnra » Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:40 am

Shu wrote:
Evinnra wrote:So, if I was born into an atheist family, it would be NOT my choice if I rejected or embraced my parents' theories, right? I am after all a computer who absorbs data and selects the useful bits, since there is no logic for my existence OTHER than circumstances creating the possibility of me emerging. Then how on earth did love come into the picture? :roll:
It would be your choice, but not all embrace that choice.

I'm not quite sure what you mean with the "love" question, Evirnnra?
That love is NOT a choice.

Reason is measurable, predictable, love is not any of these IF it is really love. The fundamental difference between reason and love is that reason can be followed step by step whereas love will only allow for a degree of predictability. The ancient Stoics held that there is no chance only causes that we do not know. True, however, there are causes that we can't figure out because there are practical limitations to matter.


Evinnra 8)
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