Hi Stephen!  It’s a pleasure to join the conversation!

I guess I was introduced to Campbell’s work by my instructor in kundalini yoga when I was about 18.  So, starting around 1975 I began hacking my way through Hero and then all four volumes of Masks of God.  I have to confess that it took YEARS to really get through the Masks of God.  I guess I’m still reading it.  ;^)

Hilariously, all of this was well before the famous Bill Moyer’s interviews, which I caught by accident.  I had never seen or heard Campbell before so when I tuned in, late, to Moyer’s interview, here was this guy with a New Yorkish accent talking to Moyers about mythology.

“Huh,” I thought to myself, “this guy sounds exactly like Joseph Campbell… I wonder who he is?”

I had always loved mythology and was, by the time I discovered Campbell, already deeply interested in exploring religious symbolism.  No other writing, at that time, had really done the work Campbell did to begin constellating these ideas into a coherent structure.  Mircea Eliade and maybe Maria Gimbutas come to mind — but I was still years away from being exposed to their work.   So, technically, a happy accident?

I imagine nearly everyone has a story about how they “stumbled” into Campbell’s work.

Philosophy and play?  Grin, this has gotten me in a lot of trouble over the years, but here goes:

Philosophy tends to be a deadly serious business and, most of the time these days, is focused largely on the logical structure of arguments.  This sort of attention to rigor and clarity is, of course, critically important when you want to unpack difficult ideas…. but…. it can also be deathly dull unless properly leavened with a bit of play.  It’s easy to get stuck on logic in pretty much the same way Campbell warns us not to get stuck on metaphors.  The logical structures of argument are the skeletons that scaffold and support our understanding but, think about it, fetishizing the skeleton over the body it supports kind of misses the point of living.

There’s a wonderful line at the end of Plato’s Republic where he says that enforced learning never stays in the mind and that education should be conducted more like play than work.  My wonderful mentor in Philosophy, Robert Perkins, made a big deal out of this idea.  Playfulness produces the kind of wonder about the world that helps us remember the most important thing: that we might not really know everything we think we know — that we might be more ignorant than we think we are.

Remembering our own ignorance might not sound like a lot of fun, but it’s actually liberating.

I mentioned it in the Mythblast but let me flesh it out here: wisdom, for Plato, meant recognizing your own ignorance.  It takes a bit of chew-time to see how that works, but it’s a brilliant insight.  Philosophy then, literally means learning to love this ongoing recognition of your own ignorance, of the limits of your knowledge.  If you think about it, failing to recognize your own ignorance about — shoot, anything! — usually lands you in hot water, and so learning to keep an eye on that, and to enjoy keeping an eye on that summarizes my way of understanding philosophy.

If I really geeked out (Greeked out?) about this I’d mention Aristotle’s famous observation that all philosophy begins with wonder and I’d argue that it’s playfulness what gets us there.

One more Greek reference then, to bait the hook for our COHO:

Socrates defined philosophy as “conversation with your friends.”   And that’s what we’re doing here!

hiho
Mark

Hello Mark; a hearty welcome and so glad to have you with us. What a great reference topic to start this discussion with. For many of us I think as you suggest we discover Joseph often in unexpected ways. For me it was definitely a “dark night of the soul”; where I had been stumbling out in the desert wasteland searching for answers to questions no one could answer. And his ability to unravel all the deep inner conflicts I was experiencing in a way that made sense to me was life changing.

As you mentioned reflection is indeed the acknowledgement and engagement with our inner self; that aspect we think we know which includes not only aspects of what we know about ourselves; but also aspects we don’t; like our unknown face; and may also include our wounded side as well. This may involve a trip down into a cave; a place deep down inside ourselves where all our uncertainties, pain, and fears dwell; those issues and things that come up in later life waiting to be witnessed if we can only hear and understand what they are trying to tell us through those aspects of our Shadow side we may not know about that have been repressed. But there also resides an unknown dimension of our unrealized potential; those things we don’t necessarily know about ourselves that have never been given a voice or the opportunity to surface. And often we use our persona mask to hide behind so that no one will see us as we really are. It’s a crisis that many times Joseph describes as life drying up and a brand new adventure is required to address it. And it may involve wrestling with inner dragons or seeking new domains or finding that inner child you forgot was locked down there and needs healing; and as you suggest it starts with reflecting and contemplation and perhaps “play” to bring it forth as Jung did with his Red Book.

One of the things that Joseph mentions in many of his Jungian lectures is it surfaces through our blind side that others see but we can’t. Those moments when we show a side of ourselves we may not even realize is there while we are doing it. And he also mentions that one of the great tasks of later life is to try and integrate this dimension of ourselves with the other side to become a more balanced and fully realized individual. In several of these lectures he recommends thinking of this as a “parallax effect”; (driving from both sides of the road at the same time; or steering from the middle of the road while balancing your view of traffic coming from both directions). Easier said than done of course; but his point is that of attempting to access your weaker undeveloped side of yourself so that whatever conflicts are blocking your ability to move forward can be released and you can move on.

If you are moving into retirement for instance and holding on to your persona identity as who you are the mask is probably at some time going to crack because you are moving into a different stage of life; and not adjusting to this new reality arrests this process. So in essence you must take a little trip down into to your unconscious and get to know your other side which often times may be your wounded self. Reflection challenges you to acknowledge this unknown dimension and entreats or invites you to enter into a dialogue with this other half and to hear it’s message; especially through your dreams. And whether you are thinking in terms of the Labyrinth, the Minotaur and that little piece of string to help you find your way out; or some other motif your myth is your guide; that inner intuitive voice that Joseph mentions may come in the form of magical aid that can give you some kind of symbol to hold on to in your journey into the dark forest of your unconscious.

And so you become the hunter, the detective, the Grail Knight with no compass or clue except your own instincts seeking a North Star of your Marga Path with only your heart to guide you. Many forms this adventure can take; but only you can go and there are no set rules for how to get there. The Greek civilization gave us so much and your examples are some of my very favorites; but for a moment I want to go back to play and childhood and the gentle humanity these stories can help provide.

It just so happens that I grew up around the Parthenon where that magnificent shield of Athena is displayed at her side; and much of my youth was informed by the presence of this incredible building and continued on throughout the goings and comings of my entire life. But something mythical happened one night that forever changed the way I saw and interpreted my story or myth that told me this whole inner landscape of mine had changed. We each have a quest or inner drive Joseph informs us that seeks to express itself; and if fortune is with us a threshold is crossed and an life achievement of some sort is acquired; the arch of life from youth to old age and death has stages and the requirements of life corresponds to them. And I had just retired from my adventure as a musician of 45 years; and was going through my new adventure/individuation process and was at loose ends of what it all meant; and this moment is where my particular reflective transcendent portal opened.

I had just taken up photography and was out for an early evening shooting expedition because dusk is the golden hour when the light is special and had come to my favorite place which just happens to be the park where the Parthenon is located. This was shortly after the Parkland School Massacre around Christmas time back in 2018; and right next to the Parthenon is a special shrine to the victims of teenage gun violence. The shrine was decorated with Christmas lights and displays that children might enjoy and was it packed with grieving parents and family commemorating their loss. Seeing this impacted me profoundly and I was determined to come photograph it when no one was around to listen to it what it had to say. As I returned later and quietly explored the different viewpoints to take my shots I began to hear the voices of the parents coming to grieve their loss and as the weeks and months rolled by I began to go back and explore all the different childhood stories and authors and teachers from my past up to the present and listen to their voices and what they had to tell me.

There would be Christopher Robin; and Mr. Rogers and all these: “once upon a time” characters from my youth and their stories and the books about childhood teaching development and childhood violence and the gun lobbyists demeaning the Sandy Hook Massacre because of efforts restricting gun rights; and all of this information was rolling around in my head until I began to get a better sense of what it was working inside me. Movies, books, and documentaries followed as I began to explore this voice it became incredibly clear that this was a synchronistic influence in the path I had been on exploring what was leading me forward. But what I could not have realized was it was the wounded voice from my childhood calling to me and informing me of what my myth was really about; and that a much deeper reflective excavation into my cave was going to be in order to heal from my past. And so the new journey began.

More Jung and Campbell; more research on different themes where I was always following this inner voice that kept leading me. My newest endeavor I have been reading is some of the work of Jungian Mario Jacoby; but I want to leave a link to a piece by the Smithsonian Magazine about: A.A. Milne, A teddy bear, his son Christopher Robin; (aka Billy Moon); but more importantly it is about childhood and the things a child needs facing a modern world; and the relationship between parent and child. I hope you’ll read it because it has something to say in connection to many of these themes in this post and in relationship to the new possible Covid world looking forward. The movie: “Goodbye Christopher Robin” is easily available online for those interested; but the article; (at least to me); reflects how the inner world of both child and adult are inter-related; and how one’s myth can change. When I found my earlier calling as a musician it was because I was motivated by earlier childhood trauma to find a safe harbor through which I could seek expression. But what I later discovered was a much stronger more powerful drive that allowed me to survive and thrive; but at a cost of which I am now starting to discover and heal. This article illustrates what can happen when fame robs a child of their sense of self; but also at the end how reconciliation can help restore meaning to a broken relationship.

In“MythBlast: Lions and Tigers and Athena, Oh My!” by Mark C. E. Peterson, Professor Peterson deduces that the Gorgon Medusa on Athena’s shield is a metaphor that one approaching wisdom is turned to stone, that is, unable to proceed until certain steps are taken. I feel his analysis and insight is brilliant and urge anyone reading this note to stop and read Peterson first.

Unfortunately the rest of his lecture, in my opinion, misses the deeper meaning. Peterson’s explanation focuses on the experience of frustration everyone has when stymied by a new problem and their need of reflection to resolve the issue. It seems to me there is a much more profound application of this metaphor.

Often when working on my own most personal issues I run into a block as solid as stone itself. It occurs like this: I become troubled by something seemingly incongruous. The tension appears to lie deeper than the immediate annoyance, leading me to question whether there is some unconscious content manifesting in otherwise innocuous events. Some brief introspection leads to a tantalizing connection that in turn brings a brief but sharp realization.

Here is where outcomes vary depending upon whether I have assistance similar to that from Athena enjoyed by Perseus in facing the Gorgon.

In the absence of outside encouragement to stay on track the defense mechanisms of my psyche kick in to stonewall my progress. I most often am led astray to some banality or another, missing the opportunity for integration.

However, if I am working through this process out loud with a qualified analyst, I am kept on track. No matter how I deflect the process the Jungian analyst challenges me to continue on the original track. In the best result unanticipated understanding was ripped from my throat as if cried out by another, more primordial creature. The catharsis was so profound it changed the direction of my life, quite literally.

Since then, the most profound epiphanies have resulted, in my own experience, from recognizing the mechanism of avoidance and deflection and pushing through these brick-wall barriers. The metaphor of Medusa turning to stone those who seek inner wisdom is, in my opinion, both valid and universal.

The ego misperceives Eternity, Necessary Being, Absolute Truth as petrification, paralysis, the negation of all possibilities.

In reality, however, Eternity, Necessary Being, Absolute Truth is the realization of all possibilities, and the realization of this realization, and the realizatio0n of the realization of this realization — ad infinitum.

Whoever breaks into the Temenos on the basis of violence, like the Titans, or foolishly blunders into it, like the devotees of Dionysus, is immediately turned to stone — whereas anyone who realizes It beyond the veils of chaotic distraction and unyielding self-will has, like the Buddha, found the Adamantine Point, “the still point of the turning world.”

Dear Mark,

Yes, thank God we don’t have to be perfect before we can approach Truth—even though the Zen people say “if you want to be Enlightened, first you have to be Enlightened”, which is probably their approach to the Socratic/Platonic anamnesis, education-as-remembering what you already know.

As for Medusa and Athena, if only they could be neatly differentiated so we could deal with them one at a time! The problem is, Athena is susceptible to transforming into Medusa in the twinkling of an eye. And, yes, you do have to get past Medusa before you can encounter Athena—that’s why Medusa’s head is on the Aegis as the guardian of the temenos of Wisdom—but you can’t do that without the help of Athena from behind the scenes, as we learn from Homer. Without Athena’s secret aid, how could Odysseus have possibly dealt with Circe?

Medusa as the guardian of the Temple of Athena is the Greek translation of “the fear of the Lord is the beginning of Wisdom” (Psalm 111). Medusa is FEAR, petrifying fear. Her snake-hair is the tangle of toxic thoughts that fear produces. The question is, WHY DO WE FEAR WISDOM? Because (as the Muslims say, Sufi Islam being my own path), in order to realize Truth we will need to “die before we are made to die.” That kind of death is actually more terrifying than physical death because we must go through it in full waking consciousness. If this weren’t the case, so many people wouldn’t end up sacrificing their lives on the altar of their illusions.

Jesus said “He who tries to hold on to his life will lose it, but he who loses his life for My sake (for the sake of Truth) will find it; take up your cross (the cross of contradiction) and follow me.” But he also said, “My yoke is easy and my burden light.” When the ego confronts Truth directly—and the ego includes the thinking mind attempting to operate on its own without input from the higher intellective consciousness, the Nous—the contradictions, the dvandvas, the pairs-of-opposites, the Symplegades, will thwart it and crucify it. That’s why we need to begin by confronting only reflections of Truth, to see it only “in a glass, darkly”. This is the raison d’etre of the Sufi method of teaching (at least initially) through allusion, indirection and symbolism—Homer’s method as opposed to Plato’s and Avicenna’s, though both Plato and Avicenna also employed symbolic narrative.

I just asked my wife Jenny to name of the Power that can overcome the fear of Wisdom. Her answer was, LOVE: “Perfect love casteth out fear” (John 4:18).

~~ Charles

Existence is MADE of meaning; according to the Qur’an, “Allah created the world with nothing but the Truth”. Physics now knows that the origin of everything that exists is INFORMATION, which means that the big metaphysical question in physics right now is “where does information come from”? Nonetheless we have to MAKE this meaning our own through creative action. Thus the human being is a trouvere (“finder”) first and a poietes (“maker”) second; if we put our role as poietes first we fall into a titanic hubris, but if we shirk our duty to MAKE something for ourselves out of what God has already given us, we become the helpless puppets of fate. The very act of perception, which is the act of finding the form or meaning that pre-exists as a given, has a creative element to it, as in the phrase “to make something out.” Without CONCEPTION there is no true perception, only the passive reception of pre-existing norms and ideas that have no life to them because we haven’t really engaged with them. It is possible to say “Christ died for my sins, by His sacrifice he paid my whole debt.” But unless we know how to actualize “take up your cross and follow Me,” the Atonement is never realized in our lives. We don’t “invent” the Jungian archetypes; they are already there as primordial and universal meanings. But without conscious engagement with them, we have not emerged from the meaningless of the shallowly-lived life. A library of 5000 books is meaningless if we never read and ponder them.

What a wonderful topic Mark! Another awesome Myth Blast!

I can certainly relate to that particular Athena as I have also stood at her feet.
Took a chance too…carrying a Native American flute into the Parthenon (Nashville: born there originally)

But the gate keepers cheerfully waved me on…there was no crowd so I had a lone audience with Her.
Athena “watched” me as I played my wooden flute and “Panned” around below her bemused gaze.
Now I’m employing my own “bad pun!” As well as engaging in “play!”

I was dancing about but no lightning bolts struck only echoes of the flute.
It is not like Athena hasn’t seen such things before in her mythic history. (Grin)

But back to your Myth Blast Mark!

1st thought: the power of “wisdom to turn to stone.”

So my reflection in response (reflection and response that’s kind of interesting too but need to climb back out of the mirror for a moment heh heh)

My reflection is that the power to turn to stone creates avoidance…or avoidance of approaching or facing the wisdom out of fear.

My thought is it takes a different angle or approach or perspective to deal with the daunting/stone-turning-wisdom.

Wrote a poem once about something similar a stone blocking knowledge or wisdom…no mirrors involved but may have to save that for another time.

Especially as so many excerpts stand out to me in your essay and that’s why we are all here!

I love the “horrible pun,” “reflection,”

feels like it is spontaneously meant to be there!

Another excerpt you mention: “situations where you dig your heels in and refuse to admit you don’t know something you thought you did, especially in those who identify with beliefs whether philosophical, religious or political that cannot endure a closer look.”

 Sometimes I wonder if anything that claims to be end of the line, regardless of the strength of its building blocks, can suffer the same “Frozen” fate? (and no cuing Elsa she’s had plenty of airplay heh heh)

  Eventually the horizon might shine through a chink in the stones—and a sun ray can be blinding.

But there are ways of looking at the sun without blinding oneself.

(My Mother had a few tips for that as an astronomer! Grin)

I love the idea of philosophy and play!

You write: “Philosophy tends to be deadly serious business and most of the time is focused on the logical structure of arguments. This sort of attention to rigor and clarity is critically important when you want to unpack difficult ideas, but it can be dull unless properly leavened with a bit of play.”

That is why I love Joe Campbell!

And what an image “fetishing the skeleton” for the sake of Logic!

Even “Spock,” has a heart—had to dig deep but it was there rooted deeper in psyche beneath logical facade.

Plato: “Enforced learning never stays in the mind and education should be conducted more like play than work.” 

And Mark: “Playfulness produces the kind of wonder about the world that helps us remember the most important thing: that we might not really know everything we think we know”

Love this! It reminds me of my Mother’s approach to teaching astronomy and also the Walt Whitman poem, “The Learned Astronomer” (which is a perfect example of the dry and rote litany—that you were referencing in regards to approaching modern philosophy)

But my Mother was on Whitman’s side!

Yes, she knew the Newtonian physics, but she was more interested in the human connection…allowing people to have their own mind blowing experience of seeing the heavens or a Messier object or Nebula in all its glory through the lens of a telescope.
She wanted the “Spirit,” to still be in the field or if you prefer “transcendent experience.” In other words, WONDER!

She was sad that so many of contemporaries or peers within the field were leaning on the dry and rote and long litany of facts.

As for play, because she was also an artist, my Mother would draw cartoons of Einstein/Copernicus/Galileo/Newton…even Euripides in the bathtub “Eureka Moment!”

She drew the cartoons on colored gel sheets, then put them on a projector.

Very fun for students young and adult alike!

Sometimes the best intuitive moments come from play and spontaneity.

And sometimes the insight or intuition comes when you are not looking for it.

Or perhaps it happens when one gives time for a space of reflection, which allows the Aha! in and the stone-turning-wisdom can be approached a different way!

Wonder seems like a very healthy balance for knowledge and wisdom.

Didn’t Einstein say, “Imagination encompasses the whole world?”

Perhaps wonder is there to help celebrate knowledge and wisdom—and keep growing/evolving/asking new questions…looking towards new horizons.
It keeps us on our toes or in reflection embracing moments of Awe.

May need a disclaimer for this next musing. Does Athena arch her brow? Because it might sound weird:

What if wonder is there to temper knowledge and wisdom by celebrating it instead of “worshiping it?”

Can knowledge which is worshiped be at risk of stone metamorphosis?

It might take a lot of reflection to move around that!

Thats why I like words like reflection and discovery which bring things back home to wonder and inspiration

rather than relying on rote, rote, rote alone.

So thank you Mark for a beautiful

reflection on Athena and wisdom…

now that I’ve finally finished “panning” all around it! *chuckle*