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September 12, 2020 at 11:53 pm in reply to: Psyche and Symbol – Mythos I – Campbell, Jung, and the Left Hand Path #3936
I really like your reflective mood and tone with this post Mars; yes; an air of Autumn indeed. Thank you for sharing your personal perspective and opening it out more. One of the things that Carl Jung said was: “we are in a constant state of becoming.” And your thoughtfully rendered addition compliments this thread beautifully.
Stephen mentioned the “Shadow’s” part within society’s: “Collective Unconscious”. Today is the anniversary of 9/11 here in the US; so I thought I would share some thoughts I offered in a seperate Facebook post:
“This is a great topic to reflect on this country’s: “Collective Shadow”. By that I mean the Anniversary of this event always refers to “what” they did to us instead of asking “Why?” When 9/11 conjures up hatred of: “Us against Them” – are we asking: “Why did they hate us so much that they would even consider doing such a thing? The answer is we have become an “it” that to them represents all that is evil and must be attacked in an act of retribution but against: “What?” we might ask! So consider this: “are we asking the right questions from a point of view that offers only the perspective from one side?”
In other words; no one asks the Native Americans how they felt when a bunch of Europeans came over and took their land away from them; who dispossessed them of their homeland and put them on reservations and have yet to acknowledge their guilt in this travesty they “still” must continue to endure! When white landowners built their fortunes on the backs of the African Slave Trade are we truly understanding why African Americans feel so bitter about: “Black Lives Matter”? And when Asian Americans think about inductions into Internment Camps during the Second World War do we ask how they feel about their national identity as citizens of the US?
It would be far too easy to just blame: “all white people”; and say these events happened back then and that our society has now evolved and moved on when just last night one could watch a professional sporting event with both teams locking arms in protest of the current racism that is gripping this country and causing riots where people are getting killed.
(Yes): we definitely have a: “collective shadow dark side” that has come roaring into the daylight from this nation’s “collective unconscious” demanding to be heard! And this virus pandemic is exacerbating the intensity of it’s vehemence!”
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(Btw; there is also the separate areas related to this topic such as: Conspiracy Theories; Fake News; and other types of “Shadow Projection” that might fit here; but for now the self-awareness of any society’s identity and how that is projected onto others is probably enough to suffice for the moment.)
Robert; those were just outstanding pieces! The first was just stunning in the breadth of it’s historical timeline; and the second was mesmerizing in it’s visual context. Joseph really liked Salvador Dali a lot; and most of us grew up on Disney; but I have to admit I was a bit surprised about Pink Floyd being included with that; but it certainly works! (Glad to have your input on this thread; keep them coming!)
As Stephen pointed out there is hardly any aspect of human life the Shadow does not reach. And as this virus continues to unfold the affects it has on individuals; (which is definitely underlined in intensity if one is confined); encourages more than the usual engagement with it; (especially concerning one’s dreams). Why? Because there is no place to hide by outside activity. And the feeling of powerlessness; the loss of control; and the vulnerability to it’s negative dark side influences can conjure up all kinds of threatening and depressive dimensions of the personality from the landfill of the psyche. And because it’s so powerful as one of the most dominant of all the archetypes it’s influence on dreamlife is deep and far ranging. But as Joseph states: “it also encloses values, positive goals – that you have not allowed to come into your life.”
As we were discussing earlier paying attention to it; trying to understand what it is saying so that as Stephen mentioned: we can expand it; bring it into the light; try to make the unconscious conscious; or in Jungian terms to integrate it. This “blind spot of the ego” is difficult to get a grip on because it is directly tied to our emotions; and emotions don’t always respond to reason because they are tied to experience and feeling; not thinking. But in connection to dreaming this is not a conscious relationship; so getting in touch with this aspect of the unconscious and trying to figure out what it’s saying means reading it another way. Images, symbols, and tone and the way they surface in a kind of dance performance may or may not make sense at first glance because they are metaphoric in nature; they point past the image to something else. And what that something else presents is for you to figure out within your own context. But there are other times when the Self is trying to get your attention; and may offer a more specific message with a more insistent tone.
Stephen mentioned some of his latest: “dream noir” series and wonderfully elaborate descriptions.
And one of the preferred methods of deciphering this very personal code is writing them down for later scrutiny.
Sometimes there may be a series where a certain theme may connect their meaning. In my own case they may actually wake me up with a specific image of some sort that ties to another one. I’ve been having a series of synchronistic events; both waking and dreaming; where something will happened of coincidence that is tied to something else I have been directly dealing with of stronger and stronger intensity and insistence.
I’ve been reading a lot of different material lately on Art, Jung, Campbell, and inner work; so much so that I would read, eat, and sleep; with a little timeout for internet breaks with Facebook and the JCF Forums; all in short 3 or 4 hour spurts for days and days at a time. This has been going on for months. Lately I have been having anxiety because of the news reports concerning the virus and our current lockdown situation. Sometimes I would have anxiety about posts I put up and would then take them down. But in my dreams there would be something a little different; the other night I was walking a path and a bright light appeared in the middle blocking my way but the tone was affirmative and supportive.
So yesterday I came across a quote concerning the Gnostic Gospels of Thomas that was one Joseph referred to: “What you bring forth from within you will save you; and what you deny within you will destroy you.” I was stunned at it’s relevance to my situation. Then last night I had another dream that woke me up with one word; that’s all: “Invictus“. I had not read this poem since high school back almost 60 years ago. Like a message in a bottle from some distant shore; perhaps my Shadow is trying to tell me something?
Although I’m certainly no authority on classical music I’ve always enjoyed many of the “Impressionist” pieces. This is one of my favorites by Claude Debussy called “Beau Soir” – beautiful evening. Joshua Bell brings a passion and sensuality to this piece that takes me to place that heals my soul when I feel world weary and need to be reminded of the beauty in life when I am tired and feeling low.
I switched this out from my earlier entry because this is not a documentary page; (sorry about that). Mary; I love Joni Mitchell; especially her album called: “Mingus”; which I thought was a true breakthrough collaboration for the time. The musicians were some of the top jazz players of the day; and Charles Mingus was one of the great jazz composers of his time. It should be noted she contributed some of the lyrics to the below: “Pork Pie Hat”; as he personally chose her to work on what was to be his last project and died shortly after it was released in 1979. Initially; Joni’s regular fans were not entirely pleased with this work since this was not the folk style artist they were use to; but she was absolutely fearless in whatever she did; and this work was proof. This was not one of her more well known popular marketed projects; and the material was technically extremely challenging; but she was definitely up to the task. (This particular live version of one of the songs was about the great jazz sax player Lester Young.)
Thank you Mary and Stephen for reawakening this thread. I want to add a clip that for me in many ways represents so many of the issues of uncertainty we are facing now. This is the first performance of this group that has since grown and thrived and to me symbolizes humanity and hope. There are plenty more YouTube performances including an “unbelievable” documentary that was done; but because of the virus pandemic like everyone else they have been forced to suspend activity. They are the best part of all of us; and never fail to inspire me!
Thanks Mary and Stephen; what great wonderfully relative pieces to today’s need for uplifting everyone’s spirits! “Get Together” was definitely the: “Clarion Call” of the (Peace and Love Movement; remember: “Woodstock?”) of the 1960’s. And this stirring collaboration of: “Playing for Change” is an inspiring example for the Boomers “passing of the torch” to the next generation to pick it up and carry it on.
In times like this when the Pandemic speaks of darkness, hurt, doubt, and sorrow we need these songs of hope and transcendence to help inspire us to keep our spirits up and help one another so we can move forward! Well done indeed!
(Al; sorry I missed you before. I’ll look forward to hearing more of your insights like what we shared back on the old forums.)
Mary, Stephen, and Shaheda: my apologies for taking so long to get back on this but truth be told this thread is practically all I have been thinking about for these last few weeks; so I’ll bring you up to where I am right now.
Mary; your extremely moving post sent me off on this journey picking up from where Stephen left off with his very kind offering of Dennis Slattery’s panel discussion; (which I missed); but none the less I was glad to have his website to go back to at some point. And I want to reference a certain section of Diane Osbon’s: “Reflections on the Art of Living – A Joseph Campbell Companion”; on pages 180-186 where in my view Joseph addresses these themes.
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(Mary): ” So there is a point I think both you and Stephen are making James, one about the difference between personal and public writing—much the way Campbell stated that dreams are private myths and myths are public dreams, our personal journals are our private myths, or our lived experience. But not just our ego experience as you both discuss, but the soul experience. This is all so beautiful I am getting tears in my eyes. I get very emotional about writing and writing down the soul.
But there is another reason, perhaps, that I get tears in my eyes thinking about this. For a long time, I have felt that on Facebook I am expected to put my best most positive face forward even when I don’t want to and don’t feel like it. While I am all for the power of positive thinking, some days when I am miserable about this virus in our world, I just want to visit with my Shadow-misery for a while, to be “allowed” to grieve before moving onward, but most people it seems cannot bear to hear anything negative on Facebook because of what I see/interpret as the positive psychology/positive thinking trend in society now. However, I also believe in paying attention to the Shadow and the negative feeling as part of the healing process. Truth is, I hate this corona virus, I am sick of the sickness it causes, what it has done to us world-wide. I get depressed at times to think this is the world my 7-year old granddaughter and her friends have to grow up in and I worry about what her and their futures will be and then I feel helpless because I wish we all could simply will this virus away. When a teacher quit her job with preschoolers because she felt she could not withstand not being able to comfort a crying child at school and would have to tell the child, “I am sorry, I cannot comfort you because we have to stay at least 6 feet apart,” well, that is how I feel as a grandmother right now and as a mother of an adult child. I would love to hug them both. And then I wish I could hug and comfort my mother or be at the nursing home—plus, I know how much I would love to be comforted too if only I could share a hug with my mother. We are all in one way or another grieving the death of life as it just recently was prior to this virus outbreak. We are trying to piece Osiris back together again.”
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There are several pieces that for me fit together that form a kind of vehicle that our inner world responds to: “The Sacred Space”, the Labyrinth and Ariadne Thread; the ego/shadow complex that is particular to each individual; the sense of Bliss and destiny one is moved by; and the separation between public and private which is affected by the individual response to outside events. I’ll try to explain my thoughts on this rather confusing combination of themes and how they fit into this thread.
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The title: “Finding Your Story in a time of uncertainty” is really the focus of this topic I am attempting to address; not personal writing per say. And this refers to many of the other various Art forms as well in that these are vehicles of consciousness that help us to express what’s going on in our inner world; and indeed to communicate these: feelings, thoughts, impressions, and problems we are experiencing. And as we progress through life; (as Jung points out): “we are in a constant state of becoming”; that is a manifestation of these combined experiences that reflect this process toward wholeness through the different stages of life Joseph talks about throughout his work. Myths are metaphors; (like a language that help us to decipher this bridge between these 2 worlds that we must learn to navigate; and “our story” is the way we make sense of this journey from the: “womb to the tomb” without cracking up.
People look for meaning; and as Joseph points out on page 16; “Life is without meaning. You bring the meaning to it. The meaning of life is whatever you ascribe it to be. Being alive is the meaning”. So that our dreams, metaphysical, and spiritual insights give us clues to theses realms and messages of consciousness to help us to get in touch with not only with what we are doing but where we need to go to answer these inner needs; yet the outer world is one of killing and eating and survival that we must come to terms with throughout our allotted time we exist.
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On pages: 180-186; Joseph goes into great detail about not only: “what a sacred space is”; but also how one might implement this: “vehicle of consciousness” into one’s life as a kind of support system that will help one make sense of and give purpose to their individual life. It’s like your own personal tabernacle in which you are enclosed and there is nothing that can penetrate this inner rescue land so that you can discover your own personal myth by which you are living. For instance he states on page 180: “Your sacred space is where you can find yourself again and again”; “A place that lets you experience your own will and your own intention and your own wish so that, in small, the Kingdom is there”. Much like a children’s playground like on page: 181; “If what you are doing seems like play, you are in it. But you can’t play with my toys, you have to have your own. Your life should have yielded some. Older people play with life experiences and realizations or with thoughts they like to entertain”. And further down he states: “When Jung decided to try to discover the myth by which he was living, he asked himself, “What was the game I enjoyed when I was a child?” His answer was making little towns and streets out of stones. So he bought some property and, as a way of playing he began to build a house.”
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On page 182-183; Joseph goes into this idea a little further by explaining what happened when his family home was destroyed and how he realized his favorite: “sacred space”; was his little library and used this as: “a reconstruction—a reactivation, if you will—of my boyhood space. When I go in there to write, I’m surrounded by books that have helped me to find my way, and I recall moments of reading certain works that were particularly insightful. When I sit down to do the writing, I pay close attention to little ritual details—where the notepads and pencils are placed, that sort of thing—so that everything is exactly as I remember it having been before. It’s a sort of “set-up” that releases me. And since that space is associated with a kind of performance is play.”
How important is this thing he calls: “a sacred space?” He further explains: “Of what value is that? It is an absolute necessity if you are going to have an inner life.” And on page 184 he goes even further: “I was thinking in terms of the sorts of conditions you set up for yourself to achieve the visit to the Grail Castle—-for that’s what this sacred space is; the space where your associations are not with the field of phenomenal experience, but with the field of your own inward life. You do not get there in the normal run of life. To visit the Grail Castle, you have to have a scared space. Then once you have found the connection in your sacred space, you can perhaps translate it into other parts of your life. But first you have to have a little oil well, that goes down deep.”
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He expounds on this idea further on page 185; by showing how one might transfer it into a more modern mobile application: “I’ve been traveling around a lot the last ten years, and when I’m not somewhere I’ve been before, the kind of hotel room I prefer is a completely noncommittal room, the kind you find in a Holiday Inn. I open my bag, put my books on the table, hang my clothes on the open rack, and that’s it: here is Joe Campbell and here are his books—so what more do we have in the world? You can turn any place into a sacred space once you have your own sacred space. However, you can say that sacred space is everywhere only after you have learned, through a meditation discipline or the experience of sacred places, what sanctity is. It is the metaphoric relevance of the object.”
He shows the mythical relevance of this idea through metaphorical references further on by using the Indian and early man’s interpretation of the mystery manifestation of the Brahman and finishes up on page: 186: “I’m thinking specifically of those Indian temples with a great wall around them: when you enter through the door, everything within that space is symbolic, the whole world is mythologized.
The earliest sacred spaces of which we have any evidence might well have been the little shrines of Neanderthal man, where there was a cave-bear skull and a lighted fire to build up a little atmosphere. The first real sacred spaces were probably caves in southern France and Northern Spain, dating from 30,000 B.C. When you go into those caves, you are in a magical sacred space, and your consciousness is transformed. I remember going into the big cave in Lascaux. It was fantastic. That universe down there seemed to be the primary world. The animals above ground were simply reflections of those on the walls of the caves. You don’t want to leave a place like that. The majesty and magic of it all somehow brings you into your own center. And once you are there, the sacred space is everywhere.”
___________________________________________________________________________________Stephen and Mary have so brilliantly and movingly articulated these themes related to this subject far beyond my meager ability to express them; so I just want to refine this focus a little bit so that others might want to add their own perspectives concerning other art forms along with writing.
So my point in relating this idea to the original topic is that with one’s personal story: biography: journals; dairies, or anything connected to this type of contextual relationship to one’s personal myth or story are mainly vehicles of access to this scared inner world of the individual. You can use many types of metaphors that can reference it: The sanctuary of a church; the Labyrinth and the Ariadne thread of the analyst; the various metaphoric stories throughout religious texts; the different cultural myths, stories, and legends throughout human history; the list is endless; as Joseph said it has: “A Thousand Faces”; but to me now more than ever mankind needs these things to keep it’s sanity; to remind us of our humanity and that the value systems these things transfer can not only help to heal us; but to bring out the best that is within us.
No one knows how all of this is going to work out concerning this global pandemic. Many of us are locked down or shut in with little access to personal human contact. And by finding and utilizing our individual sacred spaces through whatever way or method that works for us is not only important but vital for our future as human beings. So I don’t want to limit this dialogue we are engaged in to just writing; there are many other forms of expression that can serve this purpose; some can even be combined. (I’ve wrestled with this a lot over the last few weeks; and I keep coming back to this same place of our inner world that needs to be addressed; and perhaps even harmonized; but at least accessed in some way; otherwise the shadow will force it’s way out when least expected; and without the knowledge of what it’s saying can wreck havoc on mankind. Jung knew it; and Joseph knew it. So I think it’s an important aspect to include in this conversation. (There is more to include such as one’s sense of destiny and one’s Shadow complex for just two examples; but I think this is enough for the moment; plus others may have their own thoughts to share concerning other ideas not necessarily related to mine.)
Shaheda; I hope this helps to answer at least some of your questions from your earlier post; and I’m sorry it took me so long to post this; (like I said I’ve been wrestling with this subject for awhile); and you may have some ideas of your own to include.
Thanks everyone for your patience
Stephen; there just are no words to express how much I like this post. You get to so much which lies at the heart of this issue. I think for many of us we try to start some sort of description and the words seem to fall short of what we are trying to get at; (at least in an accessible way).
Your articulation of the unrecognized part of ourselves I think is spot on; and when we say we don’t want to look at it I think it also points to something operating behind this mask we may be unaware of; something that may even go farther back than we fully understand; something that drives us and may show more than just one face. For me part of this concern is learning what it is saying; what it’s asking; what it wants; and what it needs! Am I listening? Is it a voice from childhood demanding to be heard; does it spring from some insecurity that is afraid it will be discovered; or does this voice spring from some traumatic event that’s calling to be healed? And then there is the later life change of a symbol’s reference from achievement to that of meaning; from the flower’s bloom of youthful promise to it’s decent towards it’s final destination and being able to say a hearty “Yea” to it. Yes; the “Coronavirus” puts all of this and more front and center and takes away much of our control over our lives replacing it with uncertainty and unknowing where there was once solid ground to stand on.
I particularly like the idea of ourselves as being comprised of both aspects of the Shadow; (both our negative side that needs help, and our positive side with the potential for new growth); for it gives me hope that if I can come to terms with my Shadow; (as in diplomacy); I may be able to emerge a better person while still maintaining at least some part of my former identity. (We are after all unique creatures and that’s what makes us special.) But it’s the “Alchemy” that’s the hard part; the Chrysalis transitions; (from the pain and the hurt of the Larva to the transcendence of the Butterfly); that we must undergo that transforms our pain into compassion; that turns our selfishness into selflessness so that we can become who we were truly meant to be; not frozen to where it’s safe; where life is what we say it is; instead of what’s needed to become more fully formed individuals that can help not only ourselves but others as well.
There are so many messages one often hears that say: “it’s all about the achievement of one’s position, the things one has; not the person who lies behind the persona mask. And as you so eloquently described; yes; the Shadow knows! (This is not a great description; but it will have to do for now since I am after weeks of intense commiserating: “still” working on a particular long overdue post reply from another thread we were working on.) I’m sure Mary will have a much better addition to add; but in the meantime thank you for this great response to what I think is an “extremely” relevant topic right now!
(Addendum): There are of course different aspects of the Shadow; but we are basically trying to get a handle on recognizing it; (which Stephen zeros right in on). Joseph addresses at length elsewhere these different aspects of the Shadow; but I remembered this short clip that has some helpful insights labeled: The Night Sea Journey taken from one of Joseph’s lecture series that may be of interest concerning one area of Shadow integration in relation to what Joseph called: “the Abyss”; and talks specifically about one area of the assimilation/integration aspect and is listed in the foundation collections for sale as: (Modern Myths of Quest – Series II Audio: Lecture II.6.I – Mythic Ideas and Modern Culture – Vol 6)
Stephen; I am so sorry you and your family and friends are having to deal with this awful situation; I’m sure it’s stressful; especially concerning being able to breath well because of the air quality. I hope the firefighters are able to get some kind of control over this; (what little news we’ve been getting about the fires you are suffering through lately in the South doesn’t sound promising).
As you mentioned Mother Nature has been trying to get our attention; (let’s hope the coming election provides more encouraging efforts towards dealing with Climate Change and Global Warming). The last report on this I heard gives us a window of around a decade or so and then the tipping point will start to get closer.
In China and India it seems I remember hearing there were days when car traffic was either restricted or cut back on alternate days; and factory pollution was cut back somewhat as well. But that was some time ago so I’m not sure what you are hearing to this effect. All and all since the US has pulled out of the climate accords there doesn’t seem to be the kind of push forward towards newer restrictions there once was. (On the world stage I think science has kind of taken a back seat to economics except for people like Greta Thunberg, David Attenborough, and Jane Goodall.)
I know there is more going on behind scenes but it just doesn’t seem to be generating the kind of political will that’s needed to get anything done. Btw; where is Al Gore? He doesn’t seem to be as visible as he once was. Like I said; I’m sure there is more going on; but it just doesn’t seem to be front and center like it should be! Hope things improve very soon where you are!
Stephen; what a wonderful moment to bring all of this material together. I’ve been in the process of preparing a reply to both you and Mary’s posts; and just saw Shaheda’s entry earlier and was going to respond to that as well when your very insightful update appeared!
I must admit I’m not familiar with Dennis Slattery and was quite stunned after a quick search on the foundation website with what came up. (Here is a link to the Dennis Slattery page for more background on him for anyone interested. Click the green button to go to his website. ) I’ll have more to add later but your thoughts about personal writing and social media were most welcome to read.
Also speaking of welcome; a hearty hello to Shaheda; and will look forward to hearing your thoughts when you’ve had a chance to digest everything.
Robert; this is a stunning example of Archetypal influence! Indeed many of these older pieces capture childhood fantasies that follow us throughout our lives; often inspiring us to aspirations beyond our day to day experiences of normal life. Books, paintings, music all serve this realm of the muses that inspire. Definitely potential “Hero” territory here I think for this is the place of childhood creative incubation where dreams are born; and one’s sense of possibility is first awakened. (It’s all over this particular piece within it’s magical display in every frame of footage.) I hope you’ll do more of these since this so beautifully expresses how archetypes can manifest themselves within certain pieces. Especially since archetypes so powerfully evoke these: “manifestations of character” the topic of Joseph’s quote specifies.
Robert; you always have interesting and helpful insights to share. No; that was my blind spot I was working through. I was offering a suggestion to what “I” thought would be helpful. You clearly have something you enjoy and that works for you; it’s not about my insight on something. We all have blind spots and after looking at it I realized what I did and took it out. That’s the thing about internal processes sometimes; we do stuff and then we see them hopefully and go oh no; and then take care of it. No my friend; that was on me; you have been nothing but helpful since you came on board; so please carry on! Thank you for your input on these new forums; we are trying to get them off the ground and you have been playing a big part in that.
Wow Stephen; what an incredible overview you just shared; like a diamond with it’s many facets; each shimmering from it’s own reflection of a larger whole. One of the things I liked most was how you shared your insights of your own experience of your life as it unfolded; and the processes that led to your relationship of the resulting outlooks of your life now. (The journal pictures were especially revealing and gave a wonderful inside look into your process.)
We all have this potential within us; but do we step into our call to express it? The gifts of this process are enormous if the challenge is accepted; but the Dragon within us sometimes is reluctant to let you pass this threshold. Your insecurities may tell you: “Oh no; it’s too difficult; or it it’s too painful; or I don’t know how or where to start. (There’s all this stuff swirling around in my head and I just don’t know how to put it down on paper!)
Well; I’ll share a few things that have helped me; and others can add any of theirs if they like. Do you have a cell or smartphone with a camera? Go out and take some pictures of things that have meaning to you and write about them. Do you have some old mementos? Go pull them out of the closet or in the places they are tucked away and reminisce about them; and then try to capture something of these experiences. Do you have a piece of music that moves you or is connected to a deep personal experience? Listen to it and scribble a few thoughts and then go back and reflect on it and then try to put something down of why you feel this way. If this is too much at first then reflect for awhile till something you want to say emerges.
One thing I try to do is keep something handy I can write on if an important thought comes to me. (I have piles and piles of little scraps of paper crammed full of little messages to myself. They are everywhere; next to my bed if something wakes me in the night; I have a notebook where they are “semi” organized into separate piles; (each pile in a certain order so I can kind of keep them organized; lol); but the main thing for me is this works for my particular thought process. You must figure out your own way; these are just some things that work for me. My point in all of this is within this process I can navigate my inner world; and Joseph’s insights into this inner realm have been incalculable.
I came to him late in life; late 30’s; so my life trajectory had already reached a certain point where I was in a midlife crisis and not trying to figure out about school or career path; and although for each us our life choices we make may differ; inevitably certain things I think run true for many of us. We grow up into adults; we have dreams and wishes; we have life tragedies; and we must figure out where we our going; and I was at a point of impasse.
If I had heard the term Jungian; I would have had no clue what that meant at first; and indeed for many years afterward the learning curve was very long and arduous; full of all kinds of emotional roadblocks where the road forward seemed impossible to sort through in my life. I was deep in the forest now; but after finding Joseph; he was there all the time saying; “oh yes you can; you can do this – stay with it and just keep going – others have been where you are – you can figure this out just keep reading and studying and listening and you’ll get there.
There were people in this community from back then whom I will be forever grateful to; and during all of that time the funny thing is my idea of “getting there” kept getting farther and farther away from where I thought it was; and then step by step things began falling away; and the more I studied him the more certain pieces of the puzzle began to make sense; kind of like: Dorthey in the Wizard of OZ returning back to where she started – but with a new sense of awareness of my life; or as Joseph might have said: “This is it” right here; right now; this is the gift; appreciate it in all it’s horror and glory!
That doesn’t mean the struggle stops to understand one’s life; and it doesn’t mean that what you do or who you are does or doesn’t matter. But by saying: “Yes” everyday is the challenge; and “writing” about it as Stephen just shared can help you make sense of the part you play in this grand opera of it all; that; and being grateful for the journey.
So what I’m trying to encourage is for others to share some of their thoughts and experiences. We have no idea what lies ahead with this virus; and by sharing some of our common connection I think it’s possible to make some sense of things going forward. So here were some of my thoughts; I hope you’ll share some of yours!
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- 5. Avoid Contemporary Politics Given the volatile nature of contemporary political discourse, we ask that members steer clear of candidates or current political controversies. Forum members come from across the political spectrum. There are other fora across the internet for discussing myth and politics.
- 6. Be Polite Forum members come from many different sets of cultural assumptions, and many different parts of the world. Please refrain from language whose only purpose is offense. If it helps, imagine your grandmother reading forum posts – as perhaps she may, since other folks’ grandmothers are.
- 7. Refrain from Sexually Explicit Posts Please do not make sexually explicit posts within these forums, unless they are absolutely germane to the discussion underway – and even in that case, please try to warn readers at the top of your post. Not all members have the same threshold when it comes to taking offense to language and pictures. NOTE: Under no circumstances will we condone the posting of links to sites that include child pornography, even inadvertently. We will request that such links be removed immediately, and will remove them ourselves if compliance is not forthcoming. Any Associate knowingly posting such links will be suspended immediately; we will forward a snapshot of the offending page, the web address and the associate’s contact information to the appropriate criminal authorities
- 8. Refrain from Self-Promotion Announcements linking to your new blog post, book, workshop, video clip, etc., will be deleted, unless they are demonstrably part of the greater conversation. The only exception is the Share-Your-Work Gallery, a subforum within The Conversation with a Thousand Faces. If you have art, poetry, writing, or links to music and other work you would like to share, do so here.
- 9. Search First If you’re thinking of starting a new topic, asking a question, etc., please take advantage of the search functionality of this forum! You can find the search field above the list of forums on the main page of the forums. Also, consider searching on the greater JCF website – this site is full of amazing resources on a wide variety of topics, all just a search away.
- 10. Report Violations If you witness or experience behavior that you feel is contrary to the letter or spirit of these guidelines, please report it rather than attacking other members. Do this by choosing the Report button (next to “Reply”) at the top of the post, and select a reason from the dropdown menu (Spam, Advertising, Harassment, or Inappropriate Content). The moderation team will be notified. Depending on the degree of bad behavior, further posts might require approval, or the user could be blocked from posting and even banned.
- 11. Private Messages Forum guidelines apply to all onsite private communications between members. Moderators do not have access to private exchanges, so if you receive messages from another member with inappropriate or hostile content, send a private message (with screenshots) to Stephen Gerringer and/or Michael Lambert.
Visit the Contact the Foundation page, select Technical Support, and fill out the contact form.
The Conversations of a Higher Order (COHO) consists of ten public forums loosely focused on a central theme. The forums are listed, with a brief description, on the COHO home page (each forum listed on that page also appears in the same order in the menu in the lefthand column – that menu stays with you as you move about the forums). This also shows who created the last post in each forum, and when.
When you visit a specific forum you will see the list of topics people have posted so far in that forum. Click on one to read that post and any replies. Feel free to add a reply if you have something to share, or just enjoy following the conversation. You can return to the COHO home page by clicking the "Home>Forums" breadcrumb at the top of the page – or move directly to a different forum by clicking on one of the listings from the forum menu in the lefthand column of the page.
If there’s anything you want to introduce – a question, an observation, or anything related to Campbell, myth, or one of his many related interests – create a topic in the forum you feel comes closest to including the subject you want to discuss. Most forums include in their description a link to a corresponding part of the website. For example, The Work of Joseph Campbell description has a link to all his published works: you can of course focus on a specific book or lecture, but also any topic related to the ideas arising out of his work is welcome in that forum.
When posting a new topic or a reply to an existing conversation, check the “Notify me of follow-up replies via email” box (conversations unfold at a leisurely pace: someone might need a few days to let what you write simmer in the back of their brain – this is how you find out someone has replied), and then click Submit. You can also click "Favorite" (top of the page on the right when reading forum threads) to be notified of all responses in a discussion.
Click on the Profile link under your user name in the upper left corner above the forum menu. Then select Edit and follow the prompts to upload an image file from your computer.
When you finish your post, before clicking the Submit button check the box at the bottom of your post that reads, “Notify me of follow-up replies via email.” You can also click on “Subscribe” (in the upper right corner of a thread) to follow the complete conversation (often a comment on someone else’s post might inspire a response from you).
We ask that when linking to web pages, please avoid posting the raw URL address in your text. Highlight the relevant text you'd like to link in your post, then select the link icon in your formatting bar above your post (immediately to the left of the picture icon, this looks like a diagonal paperclip). This opens a small field:
Paste the URL of the page you are linking to into the field provided. Then click on the gear icon to the right of that field, and check the box that says “Open link in a new tab” (so readers can see your link without having to navigate back to the forums), before clicking the green “Add Link” button.
To add an image to your post, click on the image icon in the menu at the top of your post (it's the icon on the far right):
In the Source field of the pop-up form, click on the camera icon on the far right. This should give you access to the files on your PC / laptop, or the photo library on your mobile device. Select the image, and add a brief description (e.g., "Minoan Goddess") in the appropriate field.
In the dimensions field, you only need enter the first number (240 is a good size for starters; if too small click the edit icon and increase that number). Then select OK.
Click on the name of the person you want to contact (under their avatar in a any of their posts). This link will take you to that member’s profile page. Then click on “Send a Message,” and compose.
If you witness or experience behavior that you feel is contrary to the letter or spirit of these guidelines, please report it rather than attacking other members. Do this by choosing the Report button (next to “Reply”) at the top of the post, and select a reason from the dropdown menu (Spam, Advertising, Harassment, or Inappropriate Content). The moderation team will be notified. Depending on the degree of bad behavior, further posts might require approval, or the user could be blocked from posting and even banned.
Visit the Contact the Foundation page, select Community and Social Media, and fill out the contact form.
FAQ: Community
Before you start posting and responding in these forums, please read and follow the following guidelines:
- 1. Respect Others You may certainly take issue with ideas, but please — no flaming / ranting, and no personal or ad hominem attacks. Should the opinion of another forum member spark your anger, please take a deep breath, and/or a break, before posting. Posts must be on topic – related to mythic themes.
- 2. Respect Others’ Opinions These are conversations, not conversions. “Conversation” comes from the Latin words con (“with”) and verso (“opposite”). We expect diverse opinions to be expressed in these forums, and welcome them – but just because you disagree with what someone has to say doesn’t mean they don’t get to say it.
- 3. Come Clear of Mind In addition to expanding the mind, certain substances (alcohol, cocaine, marijuana, LSD, etc.) have been known to impair good judgment. We recommend you keep a journal while under the influence and then later make more rational determinations regarding what is appropriate to share in this forum.
- 4. Respect This Space The Joseph Campbell Foundation, a US not-for-profit organization, offers this forum as part of our mission of continuing Mr. Campbell’s work of increasing the level of public awareness and public discourse with regards to comparative mythology.
- 5. Avoid Contemporary Politics Given the volatile nature of contemporary political discourse, we ask that members steer clear of candidates or current political controversies. Forum members come from across the political spectrum. There are other fora across the internet for discussing myth and politics.
- 6. Be Polite Forum members come from many different sets of cultural assumptions, and many different parts of the world. Please refrain from language whose only purpose is offense. If it helps, imagine your grandmother reading forum posts – as perhaps she may, since other folks’ grandmothers are.
- 7. Refrain from Sexually Explicit Posts Please do not make sexually explicit posts within these forums, unless they are absolutely germane to the discussion underway – and even in that case, please try to warn readers at the top of your post. Not all members have the same threshold when it comes to taking offense to language and pictures. NOTE: Under no circumstances will we condone the posting of links to sites that include child pornography, even inadvertently. We will request that such links be removed immediately, and will remove them ourselves if compliance is not forthcoming. Any Associate knowingly posting such links will be suspended immediately; we will forward a snapshot of the offending page, the web address and the associate’s contact information to the appropriate criminal authorities
- 8. Refrain from Self-Promotion Announcements linking to your new blog post, book, workshop, video clip, etc., will be deleted, unless they are demonstrably part of the greater conversation. The only exception is the Share-Your-Work Gallery, a subforum within The Conversation with a Thousand Faces. If you have art, poetry, writing, or links to music and other work you would like to share, do so here.
- 9. Search First If you’re thinking of starting a new topic, asking a question, etc., please take advantage of the search functionality of this forum! You can find the search field above the list of forums on the main page of the forums. Also, consider searching on the greater JCF website – this site is full of amazing resources on a wide variety of topics, all just a search away.
- 10. Report Violations If you witness or experience behavior that you feel is contrary to the letter or spirit of these guidelines, please report it rather than attacking other members. Do this by choosing the Report button (next to “Reply”) at the top of the post, and select a reason from the dropdown menu (Spam, Advertising, Harassment, or Inappropriate Content). The moderation team will be notified. Depending on the degree of bad behavior, further posts might require approval, or the user could be blocked from posting and even banned.
- 11. Private Messages Forum guidelines apply to all onsite private communications between members. Moderators do not have access to private exchanges, so if you receive messages from another member with inappropriate or hostile content, send a private message (with screenshots) to Stephen Gerringer and/or Michael Lambert.
Visit the Contact the Foundation page, select Technical Support, and fill out the contact form.
The Conversations of a Higher Order (COHO) consists of ten public forums loosely focused on a central theme. The forums are listed, with a brief description, on the COHO home page (each forum listed on that page also appears in the same order in the menu in the lefthand column – that menu stays with you as you move about the forums). This also shows who created the last post in each forum, and when.
When you visit a specific forum you will see the list of topics people have posted so far in that forum. Click on one to read that post and any replies. Feel free to add a reply if you have something to share, or just enjoy following the conversation. You can return to the COHO home page by clicking the "Home>Forums" breadcrumb at the top of the page – or move directly to a different forum by clicking on one of the listings from the forum menu in the lefthand column of the page.
If there’s anything you want to introduce – a question, an observation, or anything related to Campbell, myth, or one of his many related interests – create a topic in the forum you feel comes closest to including the subject you want to discuss. Most forums include in their description a link to a corresponding part of the website. For example, The Work of Joseph Campbell description has a link to all his published works: you can of course focus on a specific book or lecture, but also any topic related to the ideas arising out of his work is welcome in that forum.
When posting a new topic or a reply to an existing conversation, check the “Notify me of follow-up replies via email” box (conversations unfold at a leisurely pace: someone might need a few days to let what you write simmer in the back of their brain – this is how you find out someone has replied), and then click Submit. You can also click "Favorite" (top of the page on the right when reading forum threads) to be notified of all responses in a discussion.
Click on the Profile link under your user name in the upper left corner above the forum menu. Then select Edit and follow the prompts to upload an image file from your computer.
When you finish your post, before clicking the Submit button check the box at the bottom of your post that reads, “Notify me of follow-up replies via email.” You can also click on “Subscribe” (in the upper right corner of a thread) to follow the complete conversation (often a comment on someone else’s post might inspire a response from you).
We ask that when linking to web pages, please avoid posting the raw URL address in your text. Highlight the relevant text you'd like to link in your post, then select the link icon in your formatting bar above your post (immediately to the left of the picture icon, this looks like a diagonal paperclip). This opens a small field:
Paste the URL of the page you are linking to into the field provided. Then click on the gear icon to the right of that field, and check the box that says “Open link in a new tab” (so readers can see your link without having to navigate back to the forums), before clicking the green “Add Link” button.
To add an image to your post, click on the image icon in the menu at the top of your post (it's the icon on the far right):
In the Source field of the pop-up form, click on the camera icon on the far right. This should give you access to the files on your PC / laptop, or the photo library on your mobile device. Select the image, and add a brief description (e.g., "Minoan Goddess") in the appropriate field.
In the dimensions field, you only need enter the first number (240 is a good size for starters; if too small click the edit icon and increase that number). Then select OK.
Click on the name of the person you want to contact (under their avatar in a any of their posts). This link will take you to that member’s profile page. Then click on “Send a Message,” and compose.
If you witness or experience behavior that you feel is contrary to the letter or spirit of these guidelines, please report it rather than attacking other members. Do this by choosing the Report button (next to “Reply”) at the top of the post, and select a reason from the dropdown menu (Spam, Advertising, Harassment, or Inappropriate Content). The moderation team will be notified. Depending on the degree of bad behavior, further posts might require approval, or the user could be blocked from posting and even banned.
Visit the Contact the Foundation page, select Community and Social Media, and fill out the contact form.